Why Dave Decided to talk to John:
John works about 17 hours a week and the only thing he does is tell people what to do. John is the founder of onlinejobs.ph (Ph standing for Philippines) Onlinejobs.ph is an online marketplace that allows employers to view resumes and qualifications of virtual assistants located in the Philippines. Through outsourcing work to virtual assistants, John talks about how to buy your time back so that you are not bogged down with tasks that can be done by other people.
Tips and Tricks for You and Your Business:
-What are some of the con’s of hiring freelancers? (4:25)
-John talks about his first hire and why it’s important to hire someone to do something you already know how to do. (6:45)
-John talks about some recruiting tips that he uses (14:00)
-We learn the different things that can and cannot be outsourced (18:36)
“No matter where you are in your career, your business, and your life – the most important thing is your time.”
“How do you recruit someone who doesn’t suck?”
“You CAN invest in this relationship because they are going to give you time back.”
Anything that can be done online can be outsourced. Hiring someone to do something you already know how to do is the first step in buying your time back. Find someone to help you so that you can work on your business instead of in your business.
welcome to funnel hacker radio podcast where we go behind the scenes and uncover the tactics and strategies top entrepreneurs are using to make more sales dominate their markets and how you can get those same results here is your host Dave Woodward welcome back to photo hacker radio I’m your host Dave Woodward today you guys are in for a fun experience we have the opportunity to bring it on John Jonas John welcome to the show hey anything from I’m glad to have you here so John’s a great friend of mine also he is the founder of online jobs dot pH pH standing for the Philippines and where he talked a little bit today about outsourcing and VA s and all that kind of fun stuff what actually works what doesn’t work what things you should look for when you’re wanting to bring someone else in and how you can actually do this so with all that said John let’s guys just dive right into this whole idea as far as outsourcing so how did you get involved in this thing so that that’s always a fun question over there I was not I was not a missionary there I did serve a mission for the LDS Church but I was in Brazil Brazil the Philippines I know dude everybody always asks I’m just a mission there no I didn’t so I was actually I taught a class at at Brigham Young University one day and I I team taught it with the owner of bat country calm and we didn’t know each other ahead of time but the the guy who was teaching the class brought us both in and and after class we were both talking and he he was obviously running like a billion dollar business an enormous business and and we were doing some similar things his was a side business and mine was like my main main business and he he says you know when you’re ready to start outsourcing some of this stuff make sure you go to the Philippines with it and I was like wow that’s different you know and I said why and he said well because in India when you tell them something and they say yes that means yes I heard something come out of your mouth it does not mean yes I understood what you said and that was my reaction to I was like Oh super different man you know and and I and I think it kind of just gave me a little bit of hope that that there might be something different than what I had experience cuz I had tried it in India and I had tried oDesk which is now up work and I had tried hiring people locally and and it was hard and when he told me that it it kind of gave me hope that I might have a different experience and he gave me a reference to where I could hire someone and I did and it completely changed my life that’s crazy kind of yeah your whole life is outsourced as I recall yeah I mean I mean Johnny you basically you just don’t do anything but basically just sit down all day long and wait for someone else to do your stuff right every time I every time I hang out with Russell he’s always like man I need to be more like you and I’m because like I wanna I should be more dedicated like he it’s he should work less like I do yeah I mean I work about 17 hours a week and every everything is I don’t do anything in my business other than just to tell other people what to do and those people are all in the Philippines I think it’s fascinating so let’s go talk about so obviously our funnel hacker community here we’ve got you know over 57,000 customers using click files all sorts of different skill levels and everything else what what types of things can they what types things can they outsource and how do they pick the right outsource I mean I get questions all the time as far as I just don’t want to do this I don’t what to do to hire the right people I don’t want to train them all that kind of stuff so just let’s dive right into the mechanics here what what works ok so I mean there’s a couple options one you can hire a freelancer right and and I want to clarify the difference here you can have a freelancer someone you hire on a like per project basis and you’re gonna hire that person that upwork.com or I think ClickFunnels™ has some you know people that are trained on ClickFunnels™ that will do something for you and this I hear is John doesn’t like freelancers I I don’t no because they don’t care about your business there once you pay them they’re gone and so any work or any effort that you put into bringing them out to speed in your business you lose that work or effort and and the next time you need something else done you have to go through that process again and I I just learned a long time ago that freelancers don’t help build a business they help you get something done but it doesn’t ever take any load off of you to hire a freelancer a contract worker someone per project right so that that you’ll never get to the 4-hour workweek doing it that way and so anything that I’m going to talk about today you can assume that I’m talking about hiring someone to work for you long term in your business whether they’re a part-time or full-time doesn’t matter but it’s a long term permanent hire I think that’s a real important thing because I’ve done both I’ve done the freelancer thing and the only time that’s never worked for me freelancer is fine for a graphic project or for some something where you’re trying to get something design or something real quick at least from my experience as long as you find the right people but if you want something like when you’re building your funnel you want something where someone’s working with you and you’re on it or your taxes or or anything that has some scalability to it at least from my experience you can’t be doing a freelancer does your right they just don’t care yeah and yeah you’re absolutely right and and then long-term you know like you hired someone who built your funnel your photos gonna change yeah you know and and do you want to go back and have to hire someone else to change your funnel that sucks you know or or someone built your funnel and now you want to add to it you want to add it an email integration or or you want to change your shopping car you want to you know whatever it is now you have to go hire someone else or no you want to start doing some SEO or some paid advertising and now you gotta hire someone else you know there there’s just there’s something with hiring someone who’s intelligent and having them do things for you because you’re teaching them how to do what they’re doing that takes a load off of you timewise and mentally so like very first person I ever hired was a programmer and I’m a programmer where I was so I that first guy who told me when I when I taught that class he told me to hire someone and I went back and forth for a couple months I waffled like I don’t know if I can hire someone to keep I don’t know if they can do is good of a job as I am I don’t know if I can keep them busy full-time I don’t know if I can afford it I ended up hiring someone and it was the most liberating experience of my life his full-time job was to do anything I asked him to do and so he started he did he did the programming that I had currently been doing and all of a sudden I was free to focus on other things and that changed right there what I realized I didn’t realize that then I’ve realized that over the years is my brain is really really good at solving problems in my business and coming up with solutions at creating marketing things or sales processes whatever it is when I’m not bogged down with whatever detail that I’m currently bogged down in my business and so hiring that full-time person lets you step away and work on your business instead of in your business and so that that you ask the original question was what works this is what works is hire hire someone long term permanent in your business so how do you actually go about I mean the hardest part I know for a lot of entrepreneurs when they’re in this situation I’ve gone through this myself and that is like gosh I don’t know it’s what you just said I know they can’t do it as well as I can am I gonna have to managing these people is it really gonna save me time so how do you go about finding the right people so I’m not sure you’re not gonna like this as you can see John will go back and forth we’re good friends on this thing so I’m not sure that’s even the right question okay cuz so what is the right question there all right so can can they do it as well as I can well that programmer was better than I was and and I and I didn’t think that was possible right other some other things like can they can they write as well as I can well you know like they’re not gonna write my style as well as I can there but I hate writing so I’m not gonna write and so it’s getting done whether it’s as good as I do it or not it doesn’t matter because it’s getting done so how do you find the good that right person that that’s the question everybody wants to know how do you how do you recruit someone who doesn’t suck yeah yes for a lot of people it’s limited resource they’re going to spend this money I gotta make sure it works yeah and you know for a lot of people here’s here’s the real the real kicker a lot of people approach this from the perspective of they’re hiring a freelancer a contract worker right because that’s all they’ve ever known and so in hire a contract worker you start off with the assumption that I don’t have enough time I can’t train this person because I don’t have enough time I can’t work with this person I can’t spend any time on this person because they don’t work for me long long term I can’t spend any energy on this person because they don’t they’re not my employee right so I’m gonna flip all of those things on their head and say if you hire a full-time person you can spend time on this person you can spend time training because now they’re gonna do something you’re currently doing which is gonna give you a couple hours back and if you spend twenty minutes of those two hours training them you’re so far ahead you can invest in this relationship because they’re gonna give you time back right okay so now that you’ve started your recruiting with those assumptions in mind it makes a lot of sense to spend some time recruiting a person to do something that you know how to do and when you recruit someone to do something you know how to do you’re so much more well equipped to find someone who’s really good so for me in the beginning I was recruiting a programmer and I’m good at programming and so I was so much more capable at at finding a good programmer and the person that I that I found his blog was a page rank six at the time which is ridiculous right because he had written a couple WordPress plugins that that like hundreds of thousands of people were using the guy was incredibly talented and he was making two hundred and fifty dollars a month for full-time work yeah just just silly and that’s not the going rate for someone like that today that’s this is your twelve years ago but the point is when you when you pick something that you are currently doing and you recruit someone to do that thing that you’re doing your ability to recruit is so much better than if you go out to find someone to do something you don’t know how to do if you’re not a programmer you don’t have a program in the very first person you recruit is a programmer I have a really hard time telling you how to pick someone who’s doesn’t suck now I I have some things that I can tell you to do but my but the very first thing is to kind of change what you’re recruiting for and and get some time back in your life and find if you’re currently writing articles or writing social media poster or doing whatever you know doing social media whatever it is find someone to do that for you if you’re currently building your final and you know how and you’re modifying and tweaking it find someone to take over your click funnel for you teach them and then you’re gonna get some time back in your life and you know how to recruit that person you know the skills they need you know you know what’s important in recruiting them I think that’s fantastic I think spreads and best advice is too often people want to have hire someone where they don’t know the skill themself and it’s a lot easier to hire someone where you already know the skill and just by that time back yeah buy yourself some time in your life and then you can move on to someone who hiring someone to do something you don’t how to do cuz you can definitely do it but the first thing to do is something that you do know how to do I love that what else should they be looking for okay so here’s here’s my recruitment process number one I do I do my own recruiting and and that’s that’s key everybody always comes to us and they’re like oh I want someone to do it for me because it’s too hard and and I know because we’ve done this hundreds of times if we recruit someone for you our which we don’t do very much our chances of success are 50/50 just we’re pretty good at it but it’s not my chance of success of recruiting someone for myself is like 80 80 percent I think that’s something people have to understand that’s really critical is you can’t outsource that part it’s kinda like you don’t outsource you’d love making we you want to make sure that I mean you’re bringing someone in here so invest in that recruiting time invest in that time where you’re like you know what I’m gonna recruit this person and bring them on my team and spend that time yeah and that will make you so much better after you’ve hired them it’ll it’ll make it’ll turn them into a rockstar much faster if you do the recruiting yourself okay so here’s here’s a couple recruiting tips number one do not do a Skype interview and that goes against everything that everybody always says I think a lot of people just like to repeat a good idea that they hear that sounds good right interview them via Skype no don’t do a Skype interview Filipinos don’t want to do a Skype interview if you insist on doing a Skype interview you’re gonna lose good potential recruits because they’re scared there’s a guy okay I’m just gonna be out I’ll testify to that one for sure I have I did that I did that a couple times and they were so apologetic the entire time they were we’re there because I did this interview with a video camera and they’re like totally embarrassed of their conditions and where they’re at and I’m like oh my gosh it just made such an awkward terrible terrible terrible yeah yeah don’t do it skip the Skype in view unless this person is gonna be talking on the phone for you like talking to customers then do a phone Skype interview not a video one okay second when you’re recruiting send lots of emails and ask lots of questions so here’s what I’ll do I will start with you know are you looking for a job yes okay tell me why I should hire you I don’t want to hear because you’re hardworking and you’re dedicated in whatever I I wasn’t creative tell me something creative about yourself and then from there I’ll move on to asking two or three or four questions per email for three or four or five or ten emails and I want to ask lots and lots of questions because what I have found is this is a this is a remote worker right you don’t get to sit in an office with them so there are different characteristics that I need that are different from an office like in an office I know you’re sitting here every day remote I don’t know that and so when I when I ask these questions I number one I get to see their English and you know it’s it’s reasonable to fake a profile on online jobs dot pH it’s you know it’s reasonable to have so your friend help you write your profile it’s not reasonable to have your friend respond to questions over and over and over again so you can just see their English and just so you know you know in a technical position this is completely the English skills are not important programmers designers webmaster English is not not relevant their social media writing it’s important right okay so number two I get to see their responsiveness if if they respond every day or twice a day or within an hour after I email them while I’m recruiting them the chances of them responding really quickly after I’ve hired them are really high if it takes them two days to respond while I’m recruiting then after they’re after I’ve hired them it’s gonna janseva taking them two days to respond is really high and that doesn’t work for me in a remote relationship where if you’re not responding for two or three days I don’t know if you’re working at all because you’re not in the office with me right okay so the other thing that does is it lets me gauge their attention to detail because for me in my brain I need someone else who’s very detail-oriented because I’m not and so it it tells me if I ask you four questions and you only respond to three of them well when I give you four tasks to do you’re only gonna do that right and that doesn’t work for me so in my recruiting process I always ask lots of questions over lots of emails and get lots of communication and I find I usually find that it I end up with a gut feeling and that gut feeling is usually pretty correct so actually hire someone then if you’re going back and forth like this is this week’s is days it depends depends on the person right like if they’re responding if I if I start an interview process with them if I start emailing them and they’re responding immediately I might get five emails in in an hour and be like yeah I want to hire you when can you start tomorrow okay great here’s your first task right it can literally take an hour it could take two weeks you know like if I maybe I’m not feeling great about this first person maybe maybe I’m now recruiting someone else and you know maybe I’m not getting what I wanted the first time so it could take up weeks but but usually like if you’re talking to someone and you decide this is I want to hire this person it’s like okay start tomorrow great let’s do it I love it so what are some things I know you outdoors everything but what give people some ideas as far as what are some of the things normal businesses owners would outsource and then worsen the wild crazy things that you’re outsourcing so one of the things I would say do not outsource is creative marketing so like don’t don’t hire someone to you’re building a quick funnel don’t hire someone to write your message like you’re the business owner you know the customers you need to write your message you need to be the creative person I’m not saying you have to create the creative you know design is you can hire a designer to do that but you should drive the messaging you know don’t hire someone in the Philippines to create customer-facing marketing materials unless you’re involved in it and then it’s fine do hire someone to manage your ClickFunnels™ do hire someone to manage your social media I’ll tell you this is something that people are super hesitant about I hate Facebook and and I I just feel like it’s the biggest time suck and so it dude it’s like it sucks you if you if you even glanced at it it just sucks and you just wasted an hour right um so for years I avoided it and and two of the girls in the Philippines that work for me we’re always like we got to do more on Facebook can we do this on Facebook can we start doing social media marketing I’m like no we can’t because I don’t I don’t know how to do it and I don’t want to be involved in it so finally they presented me a plan with like here’s what we can do and and I’m finally like okay fine you guys could use kiss I felt bad saying no to them all the time when they’re trying to improve my business you know and and so I was like fine write me some example posts of what you’re gonna do and they sent me some stuff and I was like okay you know I mean this is this is reasonable I would have changed this in this mess and I turned them on I turned him on to write and for the first like couple of weeks I was checking everything and making sure and then I stopped because I was like okay you guys you guys know what you’re doing better than I do here so today all my jobs has like I don’t know 160,000 likes you know if we’ve never done anything anything sneakier or we never bought like sign it’s like it’s all legitimate and I’ve never made a single post that’s impressive John not surprising but impressive so so I mean there’s like crazy amounts of stuff you can outsource design programming webmaster social media content writing customer service admin web map you know anything that can be done online can be outsourced or insourced I love that super cool so as people start looking obviously I mean you have online jobs dot pH what are some of the things they need to be looking for when they’re they’re working with a company like yours what should they be looking for know what how do they pick the right agency to work with that’s a good that’s a that’s actually a really good question okay so there’s a couple ways to find someone that’s really what you’re asking where do you find someone so I own online jobs dot pH but let me start with another option we’ve already talked to it up work where you’re gonna hire a freelancer and in they well you know my opinion on it right and the problem there is is they’re not gonna work for you forever they’re not gonna work here for a long time and and if you hire someone in the Philippines that is not on up work they might work for you forever and that’s just how the loyalty is in the Philippines it’s it’s amazing so you can go through an agency to find someone this is how I got started in the very beginning because there wasn’t another option so there’s tons of companies in the Philippines where they set up an office in the Philippines and they recruit workers and they bring them into the office and they mark up their salaries and they lease them back to you and and that’s fine there’s a couple issues where that one they mark up the salaries you know so like you’re paying $1500 a month and they’re paying that worker $400 a month but you know okay that’s not that big of a deal it’s you know a $10,000 a year thing whatever but the other issue is that generally you have a recruiting pool of like three people right who is your option that’s your option right and the very first the very first person that I had he was great the second person sucked and I there was nothing I could do about it because I didn’t have the option of recruiting for myself another option that I’m gonna give you is Craigslist you can try crate Manila manila Duck craigslist.org but I’ll just warn you there are crazy amounts of scams on there because it’s all free and I mean I heard someone the other day tell me I put a job on Craigslist and most of the most of the responses were from India I’m just saying there’s just so much scamming going on there and online jobs up pH we’re just a marketplace like there’s half a million Filipino resumes so you’re gonna go in and and recruit the person you want to recruit it’s between you and them so when when you ask what should someone be looking for and looking for a company really there’s not that you know there’s like you can go through an agency and and pay the markup and be limited or you can do some work yourself and find the person another option actually is to do some user like a recruiting agency what if they don’t have offices in the Philippines the people work from home but they’ll recruit someone for you and you know like I said before we’re pretty good at it and it’s like 50/50 you know so it’s still just 50/50 nope well I appreciate it ton John any parting words serious we’re get ready to wrap things up here anything else you want our users to make sure they know this course no I mean the reality is you have to try it you know you have to you have to try it and see like does this work for me because otally beer at that you gotta try cuz for me saying I work 17 hours a week and I’ve seen lots of other people do this successfully you know like thousands of people do this successfully doesn’t mean it’s gonna work for you you know you you have to try it and see you know the potential downside is you you spend a couple hundred dollars the potential upside is you get hours and hours back in your life and I think that’s the main thing I want people is kind of a takeaway is no matter where you are in your career your business or your life the most important thing is your time you got to find some way buying back time I don’t care if it’s limited hiring I think the first thing ever hired in my life was a somebody start mowing the lawn and then it was a housekeeper and I mean it just keeps going from there and and all this and you’re like gosh this I’m not good at this I don’t like doing it why should I do it and I’m I can buy back that time and spend spend that time with my family and with others that I really want to spend time with so I think no matter what you got to find some way buying back time and online jobs not pH is a great place to go ahead at least take a start and try it and see see if it works for you love it well John how did they get ahold if they want to reach out so obviously online jobs dot pH anything else I know if you don’t check Facebook you don’t do anything else so I have forced myself to be available through Facebook if you want to message me on Facebook i’ma get also I’m infinitely available through email if you use the contact us link online it doesn’t come to me if you ask for me it will get to me so so I’m available that way well I love the fact that you you live what you preach so that’s pretty cool well John thanks good we’ll talk to you real soon but talk to later Thanks you know one of the things that means a ton to me is the personal reviews that you guys leave on iTunes you wouldn’t mind going out break this show let me know how I’m doing just go to iTunes click on the episode and rate it leave a comment I read all the comments I appreciate all the stars and everything everyone already left for me again I really appreciate it and it’s my way of finding out how I’m doing so if you don’t mind I’d really appreciate it and I again thank you so much for all that you guys do have a great day
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How To Buy Your Time Back – John Jonas – FHR #196
How To Buy Your Time Back – John Jonas – FHR #196